kgbcia 8 hours ago | next |

It's weird how these headlines are written in the passive voice and as to blame Hezbollah. "At least 20 dead as walkie-talkies explode in Lebanon as Israel declares ‘new phase of war’ against Hezbollah"

How about Israel detonates 3000 explosives in Lebanon.

bamboozled 8 hours ago | root | parent |

Are we supposed to feel sorry for terrorists who's lives are spent working out how to murder and blow people up, then when they get blown up with minimal collateral damage caused, what?

Honestly, I'm surprised at how great these people are at invoking emotional responses in their favor. It's incredible. They're certainly smashing the information war.

When the 11 kids got actually blown up by a missile strike while attending a soccer game in Israel, where was all the sympathy then? Do people even know about this?

https://www.timesofisrael.com/massive-tragedy-kids-killed-in...

robert_dipaolo 8 hours ago | root | parent | next |

I think your first point could plausibly be made by either side, not just about this specific incident. I don't think killing people is ever a justifiable solution to any issue and almost always makes things worse.

I think, no matter who the perpetrator is, it's undeniable that exploding electrical items on this scale, is an act of terror and aggression.

pjc50 8 hours ago | root | parent | prev |

How do we know that all of the thousands of people injured in the pager bombings are Hizbollah?

giladamar 8 hours ago | root | parent |

Because they're the ones who ordered the pagers for their specific use. Not to hand out like candy.

Obviously not All people injured are Hizbollah, however the vast majority are.

From some interviews I saw they claimed that the majority of patients at the hospitals were military aged men. Perhaps more reliable info will come out to clarify the number, we will have to see.

ericzawo 11 hours ago | prev | next |

How does this not violate Geneva Convention?

echoangle 9 hours ago | root | parent | next |

Which part of the Geneva Convention specifically?

netsharc 8 hours ago | root | parent |

Not the Geneva Convention: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/sep/18/the-gu...

> a global treaty came into force which “prohibited in all circumstances to use booby-traps or other devices in the form of apparently harmless portable objects that are specifically designed and constructed to contain explosive material”. Has anyone told Israel and its jubilant supporters that, as Brian Finucane of the International Crisis Group points out, it is a signatory to the protocol?

Specifically it's probably this one: https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/documents/atrocity-...

But oh well, it's fine if it's Israel doing it, and any protest against it is anti-semitic and supporting Hamas and the killing of more Jews! /S

"'War crimes' are defined by the winners": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiKFAwiKjBo

thehappypm 8 hours ago | root | parent |

I’ve always thought that it’s bananas that war has rules

floydnoel 8 hours ago | root | parent | next |

indeed, war couldn't happen without rules. training, marching, maneuvering, following a battle plan- these all require discipline and rules to be effective.

if there were no structure, no rules, it would just be fighting- like animals. it could never reach the level of war. that takes human ingenuity!

echoangle 8 hours ago | root | parent |

The surprising thing is that there are rules between the parties. Of course every army has rules internally, but having international rules everyone is bound by isn’t obvious.

pjc50 10 hours ago | root | parent | prev | next |

Because it's Israel filling another country with small remote mines, not an "unfriendly" (to the US) country.

bamboozled 8 hours ago | root | parent |

Isn't it attacking a militant group who killed 11 children a few months ago? 11 children murdered by Hezbollah at a soccer game? Do you think anyone will actual sympathize with them ?

This is the nature of the game with these people, they're not an established military so what are you supposed to attack in order to stop your children being blown apart at a soccer game?

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-07-28/golan-heights-strike-...

https://www.timesofisrael.com/massive-tragedy-kids-killed-in...

Edit: Added another source because I saw some cowardly accuse me of "spreading Israeli propaganda and then deleting their comment, there's a non-bias news outlets story too, the ABC".

preisschild 10 hours ago | root | parent | prev | next |

Afaik the Geneva Convention doesn't apply at all towards Terrorists, because they target primarily Civilians.

bamboozled 10 hours ago | root | parent |

You will start getting people ask questions like "What exactly constitutes a terrorist?" and "Was Nelson Mandela a terrorist?"...

potato3732842 8 hours ago | root | parent |

>Was Nelson Mandela a terrorist?

He was until he won comprehensively enough.

From Abraham to George Washington to Ho Chi Minh to Hibatullah Akhundzada it's all just re-runs of the same plot but with different characters.

bamboozled 10 hours ago | root | parent | prev |

Would you prefer they bomb a house, school, or mosque, or some other place where they hangout with civilians to use then as shields? Because when they did that everyone was up in arms, and now they try a more targeted approach and they're "terrorists"...meanwhile Putin is basically trying to make a whole country freeze this year and I hardly anyone complains all calls him a terrorist, apparently, that's fine?

Israel is held to some impossibly high standards. Makes me wonder why?

Hezbollah has recently launched rockets into Israel and killed 11 children...as a start.

bn-l 10 hours ago | root | parent | next |

“World you prefer they go and kill 16,000 civilians in carpet bombing in residential areas?! Ha didn’t think so!”

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/gaza-death-toll-ho...

inglor_cz 8 hours ago | root | parent | next |

A lot more people died in the rubble of German cities during WWII and, except some German nationalists, no one gives a f_ck. Heck, the German far left sometimes taunts the right-wingers by screaming "Bomber Harris, do it again!"

The reason is that they were our enemies.

Edit: Can any of you downvoters explain to me how this isn't a case of blatant double standards?

If someone hates the Nazis so much that civilians in Nazi-controlled cities are fair game, someone else is going to hate Hamas in the very same way.

AnimalMuppet 7 hours ago | root | parent |

A lot of us consider it good and just that the the Allies won WWII, despise the Nazis, and yet consider the civilian bombing to have been morally wrong.

But this is off topic. Criticism notwithstanding, Israel's attack is very cleverly designed to minimize civilian casualties. This is the opposite of carpet-bombing Beirut.

bamboozled 8 hours ago | root | parent | prev |

[flagged]

keb_ 8 hours ago | root | parent | next |

Spot on. Also the 16k number is reported by Hamas and is a propaganda number. The real count is closer to 2. Also, Hamas is responsible -- Israel has killed 0 civilians.

limpbizkitfan 8 hours ago | root | parent | prev |

Irgun/Herut/Likud is just as guilty of all of these “charges”… I think you just lack the ability to rest the blame on Israel. They could have dropped cash over Gaza as reparations for the prior 75 years of genocide.

moron123 7 hours ago | root | parent | next |

Makes perfect sense.

I attack your country and kill 1200 people, and you airdrop me pallets of cash.

Great deal.

limpbizkitfan 7 hours ago | root | parent |

IDF gunships killed 1000 of those people. Notwithstanding the previous 15 years' worth of provocation since the disengagement and withdrawal from Gaza.

But my apologies, I have to consider your feelings when I think there are better alternatives to killing 300,000 people with bombs and starving another 1 million.

bamboozled 7 hours ago | root | parent | prev | next |

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_State_of_P...

Not sure if you're confused, acting in bad faith, or just don't know what genocide is OR Israel is just really bad at doing genocide?

Seventy-two percent of respondents said they believed the Hamas decision to launch the cross-border rampage in southern Israel was "correct" given its outcome so far, while 22% said it was "incorrect". The remainder were undecided or gave no answer.

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/poll-shows-palesti...

Now remember that figure was BEFORE the latest wave of violence, so just after October 7, apparently the majority of people in Palestine thought killing 1200 innocent civilians is ok? It seems like some level of self-defence is warranted given there is now more Palestinians than ever before who hate them?

limpbizkitfan 7 hours ago | root | parent |

Because Israel already inflicts the same exact type of violence onto them. Why do people magically forget 2018? 2014? Palestinians have the right to defend themselves, and especially the right to return to the land and property they were displaced from.

Hackbraten 9 hours ago | root | parent | prev | next |

Unlike rockets and other military weapons, electronic household gadgets that unexpectedly explode in your face nationwide is absolutely a thing that induces terror and fear. As a civilian, I can feel reasonably safe in my home but this supply chain attack upends everything. Contrary to what most consumers believe, there are layers upon layers of resellers and licensed subcontractors of manufacturers. Platforms such as Amazon comingle their inventory.

So what will detonate next? My RTL-SDR stick at home that I unluckily happened to purchase from a comingled manipulated Amazon batch?

This is nothing short of scandalous, and I wonder how Mossad agents can even sleep at night.

barbequeer 10 hours ago | root | parent | prev |

> ...meanwhile Putin is basically trying to make a whole country freeze this year and I don't hear anyone complain.

You haven't heard anyone complain about Russia invading Ukraine?

acheong08 10 hours ago | prev | next |

Pagers I understand but I have two walkie-talkies at home so it’s definitely not something reserved for military use. I hope these attacks don’t continue onto more civilian focused products

echoangle 9 hours ago | root | parent | next |

Does it not entirely depend on the delivery mechanism? If I receive an order from the US military for Radios and I put bombs in them, what would be the risk of hitting civilians when detonating them? Wouldn't that be OK because the probability of a military Radio being given to someone non-military is negligible? If you undermine the Hezbollah supply chain and specifically deliver to them, isn't that pretty targeted?

eviks 10 hours ago | root | parent | prev | next |

Neither are pagers, strange to tie understanding to what you personally have at home

worthless-trash 10 hours ago | root | parent |

People associate behavior and objects with things they are familiar with. This gives them some kind of grounding in context so they can more easily dissociate with potential threats.

There is a good example of this in batman, which outlines the situation well.

The joker says:

Nobody panics when things go “according to plan.” Even if the plan is horrifying! If, tomorrow, I tell the press that, like, a gang banger will get shot, or a truckload of soldiers will be blown up, nobody panics, because it’s all “part of the plan.” But when I say that one little old mayor will die, well then everyone loses their minds!

We expect that soldiers and gang bangers have risks associated with that behavior, but mayors should not.

Same with this the GP wants to believe that the pager is in a different class of 'risk' than the walkie talkie at home, and now walkie talkies are used in an attack, they are adjusting their world view.

Edit: Spelling and punctuation. I could just be talking out of my ass too.

preisschild 10 hours ago | root | parent | prev |

Apparently they were modified in the supply chain, so they might only send "prepared" Walkie Talkies to Hezbollah

rightbyte 9 hours ago | root | parent |

The rethorical Amazon of Lebanon doesn't comingle inventory?

I am paranoid about new hardware as it is. Especially those with radio tranceivers.

And that was before we knew Shin Bet have been massproducing consumer gadgets that blow up in your face.

giladamar 8 hours ago | root | parent |

As I understand, and I'm not sure many do at the moment, Hezbollah put in a very specific order from a specific supplier. It is not the case that they just used their local/national stores and bought out pagers from some common supply available to ordinary civilians. Their destination was known.

Can't really comment on your paranoia regarding new hardware. I can't say there's no reason not to be with surveillance tools everywhere. However, unless you're putting in orders for a terrorist organisation I don't think you need to worry that the Shin Bet will willy nilly add explosives.

im3w1l 8 hours ago | prev |

What I'm noticing is that this attack, or series of attacks seems to upset people in a way they struggle to verbalize. They try to reach and call it terrorism or war crime but it seems to be neither.

Maybe the real explanation is that this kind of weapon is simply too powerful and terrifying and that's why people want it to be taboo? We become more and more dependent on technology everyday, we are slowly trusting our lives to self driving cars even starting to put electrodes into our brains. The thought of someone tampering with that, it's too scary.

I think that might be what is going on.

inglor_cz 8 hours ago | root | parent |

I can see where the anger comes from.

It is the "distributedness". People like to split the world into clean zones: here is war, after this border, no more war. After all, the risk gradient jumps extremely when you cross the border from Poland into Ukraine.

An attack like this a) reveals that some people aren't what they perhaps pretended to be, e.g. civilians, b) shows that war can reach with very long fingers into places that considered themselves relatively safe.